HenryJ wrote:If your voltages are dropping to 10 you have problems and need to upgrade the wiring harness. The crew cabs are sitting pretty good there. I have a good alternator to match the accessories that I have added. Performance is at or just above stock. With 14.2 volts at the battery the lights get 13.5 or better. I used the lumens rated at 13.2 volts , so I do not see it out of line.
Thats just it, you upgraded your alternator. How much does that costs? 150 bucks? What I am saying is that, not all of us have done that, and our s10 alternators aren't known for stellar performance correct? Also, the HID kit doesnt need a wiring harness, nor does it need more than 10 volts, but the kit includes one, just for the safety factor. I will try and find my multimeter (lost it last week), and take some measurements on my truck asap. I dont think it will be that far off...
HenryJ wrote: I don't think the difference is that big and that is what I an trying to point out here. Measurements with a light meter would be helpful. Hopefully you can have an independent source measure that for us.
Here ya go, this is the lamp. Not one thing is different dealing with the optics.
![Image](http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c113/bcarr1970/comparisionbeam.jpg)
Is the mounting system modified? Sure. Doesnt affect anything.
HenryJ wrote:The automobile manufacturers have been seeking this technology for a long time and many reasons. You are right that someday, the halogens may go the way of the sealed beam lamps. I think it is still going to be a while before that happens , if ever. They are not convinced yet either. Again cost not safety is the deciding factor here. They would build us a safe car if we demanded it, but we could not afford it. Are HID a big enough difference to be listed as a great mod for safety? I don't think they are in this application as there are less costly methods that offer close performance.
We have our opinions, that is fine by me!
HenryJ wrote:The quoted data was for a different HIR bulb design that failed. Your secret data really doesn't help. We need to stick to manufacturer data. If you quoted Osrams specs. That is fine. I only dispute the use of the GE HIR specs being compared to the only available HIR bulb from Toshiba. While they may be the best we have the difference needs to be noted.
The GE bulb didn't fail. GE sold the technology to Toshiba. GE doesn't have ground in the automotive field and decided to stay away from it. Its the same bulb. Those specs are the specs of the bulbs sitting in your headlights, period.
Also, I dont have secret data. It is just data that was collected with alot of expense, henceforth its not normally public information.
And if you are referring to the specs listed by that one ebay guy, all I have to say is he admitted to using "ancient 1950's testing equipment". I don't think I need to say more. I guess he also has a 0 lux room in his garage to do such measurements in?
...once you have this much controlled light available for low beams, you will never want to go back.
HenryJ wrote:Agreed. I do have that now.
No you dont, you are still anywhere from 750-1000 lumens short.
HenryJ wrote:I don't see yours being a huge difference over the $60 HIR/highbeam bulb mod.
Once again, pure opinion. Im speaking from having stock in my left hand and HID conversion in my right hand. I can speak from experience.
I told everyone on here already that these are OEM produced optics, so why would those be illegal if people are driving around every day with them on the front of their trucks?
HenryJ wrote: They have them installed in a reflector designed for the application, as I hope yours will be approved someday.
How about getting approved five years ago?
HenryJ wrote:You can not just take a handful of DOT approved things, put them in another vehicle and still hold the DOT approval.
Yep you are exactly right! All I have done is change the mounting system, and replaced a piece of clear uv protected lexan, with clear uv protected lexan. It is up to the end user to decide if they want to "take that risk" of converting to better HID lighting like this conversion setup.
HenryJ wrote:The bulb is approved, the reflector too, but the two together have not.
Yes they have been, five years or so ago.
HenryJ wrote:You have the same situation as no only are you altering the lens and mounting system, but installing it on a different vehicle. In my case, if they want to push it I will have to remove them. I don't want to pull a $500 set of headlamps.
If someone every gave you grief over them, to the point you have to dump them, ill buy em back
HenryJ wrote:Different reflectors and lamps are allowed different maximums. That is what I was trying to determine. What is the maximum allowable candella for your light and reflector.
Well, any low beam optic is held to the same standard within FMVSS108. I dont care if its on a Hyundai or a Mercedes( well an American version).
What I have is a low beam optic, and it has been verified by Osram Sylvania and Grote Industries to fall within FMVSS108 low beam specs.
FMVSS108 calls for a maximum of 3250 "luminous flux", which are simply measured in lumens. As I have said before, these optics produce 3200 lumens. We are still within legal spec, AS THEY SIT IN THE GARAGE.
HenryJ wrote:t;] Sorry , I am a bit lost in your Lumens to candella conversion. The two are different measurements. Like measuring a pool of water, and a stream. Both have a given value of light but the two differ in the application. Manufacturers like to boast lumens where the DOT is worried about candela.
I showed you the equations and the math. It is what it is.
HenryJ wrote:I am learning a little here too. You have no way of measuring yours yet, since this measurement maps the light at a given point.
The given point you are referring to is called "H-V". You get to this point by drawing a line through the center of the bulb, inline with the filament,straigh out into space. Then you draw a line on the wall that is on the same plane as the first line you drew when the bulb mounting surface is perfectly vertical. This has been mapped on the optic I am selling, but is not public information. Believe you me, if I could obtain a hard copy of it, I would post it in a heartbeat.
HenryJ wrote:You will have to gather that data for this application to receive DOT approval would be my guess. The angle of the light is where the difference lies. Until you have one mounted on an s-series there is no way to correctly measure. Your calculation shows that this may be an easy hurdle as you seem to be well under the maximum. This is again where I wonder.
Vehicle application doesnt matter. See above about "H-V". That is how this is negated. And yes, the candela hurdle, is in fact, not a hurdle at all.
HenryJ wrote:The idea is a big improvement, yet not to the maximum potential, and maybe even equal to less expensive options.
I agree and I agree. Reflectors just look better. People dont like projectors due to the bugeye look. All you would have to do is buy the ebay projector lights for our trucks and swap in true HID projectors. Piece of cake and bi-xenon capability, the best output hands down I dont care what you say, and probably for around ohhhhhh Id say $450 if done by me.
HenryJ wrote:I think you could appeal to a bigger market and have better success working on a 100% HID system, or at the very least using them on the highbeam. Huge potential is there for gains where you are not worried about blinding on coming traffic. If I am going to spend $500 on lights they better be 500% better than what I have already.
Would these lights be better than the stock halogens? Sure they would! $440 better than HIR modded lights? I am not so sure.
Well if you never try it, you will never know "for sure"! And as far as 100% HID, read above paragraph.