brake rotors!!!!

top_sgt · Post by **top_sgt** » Wed Jun 07, 2006 3:54 pm

take a look guys.......

does this look "normal"????????
i've taken several photos of my rear rotors...going to dealer tomorrow!!

killian96ss · Post by **killian96ss** » Wed Jun 07, 2006 4:01 pm

top_sgt wrote:does this look "normal"????????

I would have to say NO that doesn't look normal!

How is the other side of the rotor and what about the other rear rotor?

Steve

top_sgt · Post by **top_sgt** » Wed Jun 07, 2006 4:04 pm

the out side of the rotors is smooth and shinny......just like you would expect.. the pic is the left rear inside....the right looks just like it!!

Pauleo · Post by **Pauleo** » Wed Jun 07, 2006 4:06 pm

Hey Top. Check out this old thread HERE. I had a similar problem with mine.

EDIT: Thanks to the

who fixed my long url!!!

top_sgt · Post by **top_sgt** » Wed Jun 07, 2006 4:15 pm

i did the fronts a couple of weeks ago. the front rotors had some rust on the inside, but not like the rears. had the front rotors turned...no problem. i think the rears are a "little excessive" in my opinion. i've gotten to know one of the service writers pretty well. hope he can help me out.

might have to tell them i have a "vibration" when braking from the rear!!! mine is still under waranty!!!!!

killian96ss · Post by **killian96ss** » Wed Jun 07, 2006 4:19 pm

top_sgt, how many miles do you have on these rotors and did the pads on the rear rotors wear unevenly? For example, was one pad a lot thicker than the other when you removed them?

To me it really looks like frozen caliper slide pins caused your problem. Did you check to see if your calipers were able to slide freely?

Steve

F9K9 · Post by **F9K9** » Wed Jun 07, 2006 4:20 pm

I feel a lecture from killian96ss coming on Mr. former "wrench head"

top_sgt · Post by **top_sgt** » Wed Jun 07, 2006 4:49 pm

not to bust any bubbles........and being a former "wrench".............which some of you all may have not known..................

rear pads are worn evenly,,, caliper not stuck.......slide pins sliding.. and lubed!!!!!!!!

mechanically,,, the brakes work ok......i replaces the fronts at about 28,000 miles.. a week later i start hearing noises when braking. tonight i took things apart for a "complete" inspection. fronts OK!!!!!!

rears rotors look like @#$%!!!!!

top_sgt · Post by **top_sgt** » Wed Jun 07, 2006 4:51 pm

just wanting to know is this abnormal??!!??,,,,,, or do we have cheap brake parts, and do we need to invest in "real" brake parts??!!??!!

F9K9 · Post by **F9K9** » Wed Jun 07, 2006 4:54 pm

Calm down, David

You are beginning to resemble someone we both know

killian96ss · Post by **killian96ss** » Wed Jun 07, 2006 4:57 pm

top_sgt wrote:mechanically,,, the brakes work ok......i replaces the fronts at about 28,000 miles.. a week later i start hearing noises when braking. tonight i took things apart for a "complete" inspection. fronts OK!!!!!!

rears rotors look like @#$%!!!!!

Why did you have to replace your front rotors at 28k?

I have over 82k on my stock front rotors and pads with about 30% still left. Do you have any pics of the brake pad surfaces that made those marks on the rotors?

Steve

killian96ss · Post by **killian96ss** » Wed Jun 07, 2006 4:58 pm

top_sgt wrote:just wanting to know is this abnormal?

YES

Steve

top_sgt · Post by **top_sgt** » Wed Jun 07, 2006 5:07 pm

f9k9 wrote:Calm down, David You are beginning to resemble someone we both know

i am calm!!!!

top_sgt · Post by **top_sgt** » Wed Jun 07, 2006 5:09 pm

the rears pads are about the same...except that the inside pad is worn like the inside of the rotor.....has a flat spot in the center, kinda groovy on the edges. i did take a pic of the pads....i'll post it.

top_sgt · Post by **top_sgt** » Wed Jun 07, 2006 5:14 pm

the pic i have of the pads did not show the grooves very well. sorry!!

by the way,,,have about 28,000 on my truck,,,turned the rotors, replaced the pads!!!

killian96ss · Post by **killian96ss** » Wed Jun 07, 2006 6:13 pm

top_sgt wrote:by the way,,,have about 28,000 on my truck,,,turned the rotors, replaced the pads!!!

This is the part I don't understand.

Why did you have to have the rotors turned and pads replaced when you only have 28k miles on your truck.

Steve

Post by **Walt** » Wed Jun 07, 2006 6:19 pm

Wow....I have 65K miles on my truck and haven't even looked at the brakes. Guess it's time to inspect the rear rotors

On my 00 Sonoma, when I new pads put on, one of the pads was defective and broke apart, leaving the rivets to grind into my front left rotor for a few days, which left a nice 1/4" groove in it.

jeff024 · Post by **jeff024** » Wed Jun 07, 2006 10:26 pm

both front and rear on my truck I replaced pads only around 75000 the rotors were good when traded at 115000

top_sgt · Post by **top_sgt** » Thu Jun 08, 2006 12:56 am

that's why i'm headed to the dealer today!!!!!
i have a lot of questions for them about brakes.

i would have thought the pads should last longer myself.
i'll let you all know how it goes!!!!!!!

daevans315 · Post by **daevans315** » Thu Jun 08, 2006 9:22 am

I bought my truck used at 28,000. At about 33,000 discovered this issue on all 4 wheels. Outside face of the rotor looked great.. Inside face was only shiny in half of the swept area or less. When I took them in to have them turned (which was refused due the amount of rust.. it dulls their cutting tools?)
The brake guy said that this type of ‘failure’ was due to them sitting and building up a good deal of surface rust on the rotors and when they are driven they don’t always clean up correctly. He said that with mine being on all 4 wheels it probably set outside without being driven for several months. Generally the fronts have enough pressure and heat to polish up but this is pretty common on the rear disks. He said short, easy on the brake, trips during this time, that don’t clean them all the way up make things even worse.. the middle gets cleaned an polished… the outside stays rusty. The polished part doesn’t start to rust as fast as the part that has the rust already on it, so it becomes a replicating failure. The rusty part now wears down the pad faster than the polished part on the next trip so it doesn’t have a chance of ever cleaning itself up.
Mine sat at the dealer for 5 months before I bought it... I’m guessing it had a few short test drives in that time.

I’m not sure I buy his explanation 100% but it seems plausible.

top_sgt · Post by **top_sgt** » Thu Jun 08, 2006 10:22 am

daevans315 wrote:
I’m not sure I buy his explanation 100% but it seems plausible.

it would seem plausible......but this is my daily driver!!! it may sit a day or two,,,,but that's it. it had 7000 miles on it when i got the truck. was at the dealer maybe 3 weeks. so,,,,we'll see what my dealer says this afternoon.

killian96ss · Post by **killian96ss** » Thu Jun 08, 2006 10:54 am

daevans315 wrote:I’m not sure I buy his explanation 100% but it seems plausible.

I'm certainly not a brake system expert, but what you are being told sounds like complete

on several different levels.

I have had plenty of drums and rotors turned that were covered in rust and it was never a problem.

I have worked on cars/trucks that sat for years and the rotors never had the problems being described in this topic.

I don't think this is a common problem, and I'm starting to believe the pads are possibly defective especially if the calipers are working and sliding correctly.

There may be some truth to this rust theory, but I have never seen a rotor fail because the vehicle sat for a while.

Steve

AZS10Crew · Post by **AZS10Crew** » Thu Jun 08, 2006 6:16 pm

Most of the issues I see at my dealership with rusty rotors is rust pitting. In order to machine the rust all the way out you would make the rotors too thin, thereby causing warping upon first use. As far as dulling the lathe, that sounds like B.S. Rust is softer than metal, and those lathes cut metal all day.

FWIW...the pads on the crewcab when I traded it in were probably at least 50% left with 64K on the truck. GM rotors are notoriously thin though too, and pretty inexpensive compared to the Ford ones I see. Most Ford rotors average around $100 ea while GM ones we've done are around $35 ea.

BADs Crew · Post by **BADs Crew** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 2:04 am

Looks just like mine did after I discovered my mechanics weak point.

Great Brake Job

top_sgt · Post by **top_sgt** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 7:18 am

dropped the truck off at the dealer last night. talked to the service rep, he said he could get GM to cover turning the rotors.

will pick my truck up this afternoon......details to follow!!!

top_sgt · Post by **top_sgt** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 11:32 am

just got the truck back. the dealer said they could not turn the rotors, and that the pads were "damaged" because of the rotors.

so............................

i got new pads and rotors on the rear, compliments of GM waranty!!!!!

i be happy now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

WVHogRider · Post by **WVHogRider** » Wed Jul 12, 2006 1:37 pm

Killian96ss, I just wanted to thank you for all of the helpful tips on the brake topic(s).

Around 45,000 miles, my truck failed the state inspection due to the brake pads, (front DS front inside pad and the PS inside rear pad) being worn. (Living in the mountains of WV and having a heavy right foot does not make brakes last long.) So I replaced the pads myself. I ended up putting the top of the line "metalic" pads that the Advanced Auto Parts guy recomended, then I replaced the pads again a year later with a different brand of "metallic" brake pads that the Autozone guy recommended, and then just replaced the front rotors and calipers due to a huge brake dust issue. The brake dust issue is still there. These auto parts guys never said anything about our rotors prefering the ceramic pads or the lubing of pins, ( I didn't know to lube pins as I had only done a brake job one other time and that was on my Chevelle that has the solid mount brake calipers). Well, looks like I will be replacing the pads this weekend, and while I got everything apart, maybe I'll up grade to the slotted rotors and flush out the lines as I'm still on the original brake fluid as well.

Again Thanks.

F9K9 · Post by **F9K9** » Mon Jul 24, 2006 8:49 am

killian96ss posted in a thread here somewhere about the importance of lubricating the caliber guide pins. He does it with every oil change (3K miles).

I tried to live up to Steve's (killian96ss) standards but, I probably have done my pins at every other oil change. I finally relocated my e-brake brackets this past weekend and I started feeling guilty about paying attention to the guide pins. I decided to go ahead and perform the procedure and I found one frozen on the rear driver's side. I finally got it out and it was in bad shape.

This is not a scheduled maintenance item in our owner's manual and it is something that I wouldn't have given a seconds thought to but, I am beginning to think that it should be a required part of preventative maintainance now!

I know that Top_Sgt had his lubed and we still don't have an answer for what caused the rotors to rust the way that they had on inside of the rear ones except that they possibly sat too long without being driven. Well, I bought mine in May of '04 and it is a an '02. It had 600 miles on it so, it sat for a long time. Why would sitting only affect the inside of the rears and not the other three rotor surfaces on our trucks?

killian96ss · Post by **killian96ss** » Mon Jul 24, 2006 11:07 am

I definitely check the caliper slide pins every oil change, but I only lube them every other oil change (every 8k miles).

Make sure you use a good high temperature synthetic caliper grease, and NEVER ever use chassis grease. One other thing you should check while lubing the slide pins is the little rubber boots that hold the grease in. If any of them are starting crack or the rubber is torn make sure you get new ones very soon.

Steve

F9K9 · Post by **F9K9** » Mon Jul 24, 2006 2:19 pm

killian96ss wrote:I definitely check the caliper slide pins every oil change, but I only lube them every other oil change (every 8k miles). Make sure you use a good high temperature synthetic caliper grease, and NEVER ever use chassis grease. One other thing you should check while lubing the slide pins is the little rubber boots that hold the grease in. If any of them are starting crack or the rubber is torn make sure you get new ones very soon.

Steve

Yes, Mother dearest

killian96ss · Post by **killian96ss** » Mon Jul 24, 2006 2:35 pm

f9k9 wrote:Yes, Mother dearest

...............

Steve

F9K9 · Post by **F9K9** » Mon Jul 24, 2006 3:25 pm

Not a brand name to me but beat the heck out of the darn 99 cent squeeze packs at the check out!

killian96ss · Post by **killian96ss** » Mon Jul 24, 2006 3:33 pm

Not a well known brand, but I have used stuff from them before.

I used to buy those 99 cent packets which work just fine, but it never failed that I would get 3 calipers done and need more.

Steve

WVHogRider · Post by **WVHogRider** » Wed Jul 26, 2006 6:33 pm

Those pins are a PITB. I just replaced the pads at all four corners with the life time replacement ceramic pads from Autozone. Lubed all pins except the two that were stuck on the rear. One on each rear. I couldn't budge them. So I'll have my buddy, the dealership's finance manager, pick up my truck and take it to work with him to fix the two sticking pins, e-brake adjustment, and brake fluid flush and refill. I think I may also have a front caliper with a pinhole leak. I noticed a small amount of fluid on the rubber expansion material after I C clamped the caliper in.

F9K9 · Post by **F9K9** » Wed Jul 26, 2006 6:57 pm

WVHogRider wrote:................... Lubed all pins except the two that were stuck on the rear. One on each rear. I couldn't budge them.

Just for sh_ts and giggles, were the pins in the same location on both rear sides, i.e., lowest ones?

I tossed a rachet on mine and cranked it in both directions awhile. I then tossed a visegrip on it (I knew it was trashed and no 3M pad was ever going to make it right) and wiggled it out.

killian96ss · Post by **killian96ss** » Wed Jul 26, 2006 6:58 pm

WVHogRider wrote:Those pins are a PITB.

Lubed all pins except the two that were stuck on the rear. One on each rear. I couldn't budge them.

For some reason the rear slide pins always seem to freeze first.

I bought some custom made stainless slide pins for the rear discs on my SS to help prevent the usual corrosion problem.

I wish someone made some stainless slider pins for the S-Series trucks.

I bet there are a lot of CC owners on this site who have frozen slider pins and don't even know it.

I once witnessed a catastrophic failure of frozen slider pins at the track which resulted in the pins snapping which in turn allowed the caliper get wedged in between the wheel and rotor causing an automatic lock up of that wheel.

This failure was on a 96 SS like mine and the driver lost control in a turn and skidded off the track.

Luckily he was not injured, but this is the one of the reasons why I check my slider pins so often.

This problem affect almost all vehicles that use floating calipers.

Steve

WVHogRider · Post by **WVHogRider** » Wed Jul 26, 2006 7:09 pm

I think they were both the top pins, but not exactly sure now that I think about it, as I was slightly distracted from time to time.

I had my 5yr old daughter over at my parent's house playing with my 6yr neice & 9yr old nephew. All three like to gang up on me--You know--try to wrestle me down-Shoot me with squirt guns & etc. cause I'm really just big kid inside. Actually, I usaully start torturing them first.

F9K9 · Post by **F9K9** » Thu Jul 27, 2006 1:49 am

That's interesting. Mine was a top pin!

04crewvt · Post by **04crewvt** » Thu Feb 08, 2007 4:21 pm

I was informed at the dealers that all 4 of my rotors look like Top Sgt's.

They said this was causing my brakes to grab and be mushy at times. They wanted $130/axle to turn the rotors but that the pads were still good.

I passed for now. They said this was caused by getting them too wet and not breaking hard enough to scrub them clean ???? They suggest after getting them turned I should power brake a couple times a week to help keep them cleaned off. Sounds fishy to me.
Guess when the weather gets a bit better I will have to do the caliper service and lube the slide pins and get the rotors turned by someone else at a better price.

killian96ss · Post by **killian96ss** » Thu Feb 08, 2007 4:27 pm

04crewvt wrote:They said this was caused by getting them too wet and not breaking hard enough to scrub them clean ???? They suggest after getting them turned I should power brake a couple times a week to help keep them cleaned off. Sounds fishy to me.

Steve

LonestarZ · Post by **LonestarZ** » Thu Feb 08, 2007 9:27 pm

Definite

And for $130 per axle their better be new rotors and pads.. otherwise your getting pillaged.

04crewvt · Post by **04crewvt** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 2:08 am

Nope that was the price to just turn the rotors not to replace them and the brake pads are still in spec so they were not replacing them either. Unfortunately they will not cover under warranty. Just something they don't want to admit is a problem I guess. I will have to decide on turning these down or picking up a high performance set that might work better than stock.

Post by **HenryJ** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 6:51 am

What are our options for performance rotors?

I would like to have a set that are coated , or protected. Maybe even slotted or ventilated?

Seems as if I have seen some with an aluminum coating to protect the surfaces that are not cleaned by braking.

killian96ss · Post by **killian96ss** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 8:01 am

HenryJ wrote:What are our options for performance rotors?

I would like to have a set that are coated , or protected. Maybe even slotted or ventilated?

Seems as if I have seen some with an aluminum coating to protect the surfaces that are not cleaned by braking.

The best aftermarket performance rotors I have seen lately are from Power Slot.
They are slotted and silver cadmium plated.
There are a few other companies that sell similar rotors, but the blanks that they start out with might be made of poor quality metal.

You do not want drilled rotors or drilled and slotted rotors.
Stock rotors will actually perform better than the slotted rotors in 90% of most driving situations.

Slotted rotors will only work better than the stock rotors when they are really wet or during a very hard panic stop.
These 2 situations don't happen very often.
Stock rotors have more pad to surface contact area and will actually stop your vehicle better in most situations.
Most people get drilled and slotted rotors because they look cool and the think that they work better just because the manufacturer says they are better than stock rotors.

I have put several different styles of rotors to the test on road courses in my 2 ton SS and the stock rotors are a pretty good compromise for street and some track use.
Drilled rotors do perform better on the track, but not during every day street use.

There is a reason why 95% of production vehicles come with standard rotors.

If drilled/slotted rotors stopped your vehicle better and were safer than standard rotors you can bet they would be standard on most cars since all auto manufacturers strive for safety.

The 5% of cars that do come with factory drilled/slotted rotors are usually very fast like Porche's, Corvette's etc.
They need to have brakes that match their speed ratings.

Steve

Post by **HenryJ** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 10:13 am

Do you have any links to some rotors from "Power Slot"? Information , application chart and pricing would be nice.

I agree with everything you said above. 95% of the time I would not need them. They might be an asset for coming down Lions Back though. I am considering a few locations that may require situations where long periods of braking are required. Improved heat dissipation would be an advantage.

The stock stuff really does do a good job, but I like to have all the alternatives considered.

2kwik4u · Post by **2kwik4u** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 11:46 am

Slotted rotors tend to resist fade a bit better than standard rotors as well. I had a set of powerslots on my old ranger and liked them. Haven't made the leap yet on the Xtreme though.....The ZR5 will be getting some when the stockers "wear out", and I can justify the expense, mainly looking forward to towing duties.

My other thought is to get some new wheels, and put C5 calipers, and rotors on the front, and some LS1 rotors on the rear. Weather that ever happens or not is another story though.

Post by **HenryJ** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 12:03 pm

I did a quick check on Summit:
PSR-8638PSL Power Slot Performance Brake Rotors
Brake Rotor, Slotted, Iron, Silver Cadmium Plated, Left Front, Chevy/ GMC/ Oldsmobile, S-Series/ Bravada, Each
Today $115.95

PSR-8638PSR Right Front $115.95

PSR-8639PSL Left Rear $101.95

PSR-8639PSR Right Rear $101.95

Summit wrote:Brand: Power Slot
Product Line: Power Slot Performance Brake Rotors
Intended for Street Use: Yes
For Use with Stock Calipers: Yes
Rotor Construction: Vented
Rotor Style: Slotted surface
Rotor Outside Diameter (in): 10.820 in.
Rotor Thickness (in): 1.138 in.
Rotor Material: Iron
Rotor Finish: Silver cadmium plated
Quantity: Sold individually.

Brake Rotor, Slotted, Iron, Silver Cadmium Plated, Left Front, Chevy/GMC/Oldsmobile, S-Series/Bravada, Each

Improve stopping power!
These Power Slot performance brake rotors are designed to improve your stopping power and eliminate brake fade. They feature a Vac-U-Slot design that sheds heat and gaskets faster, while maintaining a clean pad surface, significantly reducing brake fade. Only the finest castings are used for optimum rotor wear, balance, and reliability, and silver cadmium plating provides superior corrosion resistance and helps retain that new look. These rotors are a terrific choice to replace your OE rotors.

That comes to just under $450 shipped.

2kwik4u · Post by **2kwik4u** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 12:35 pm

"Sheds heat and gaskets faster"......I love typos

killian96ss · Post by **killian96ss** » Fri Feb 09, 2007 1:57 pm

Another thing to consider is that slotted rotors act like "cheese graters" for your brake pads.

In other words you brake pads will not last as long since the sharp edges on the slots kind of shave off material as the brakes are being applied.
Even though your brake pads will not last as long the "grating" or "shaving" of the pads actually helps keep them clean which in turn helps prevent glazing caused by brake fade.

Before I wrecked my CC I was seriously looking into getting the Power Slots as a performance upgrade.
I run Power Slots on my SS and have been very happy with!

I would be even happier if the price was about 1/2 what they are now.

Steve

ace · Post by **ace** » Wed May 16, 2007 12:45 pm

Just came back from an oil and filter change and the mechanic said my rotors look just like the picture at the beginning of this thread. He said he can't turn them either. Too much rust.

killian96ss · Post by **killian96ss** » Wed May 16, 2007 1:18 pm

ace wrote:He said he can't turn them either. Too much rust.

Can't turn them because of too much rust or because they are worn past the minimum thickness?

Steve

Wrangler · Post by **Wrangler** » Wed May 16, 2007 1:59 pm

killian96ss wrote:
ace wrote:He said he can't turn them either. Too much rust.
Can't turn them because of too much rust or because they are worn past the minimum thickness?

Steve

The garage I worked at in high school wouldn't turn them if they were really rusty. As cheap as they are I wouldnt waste time or money turning them

Post by **HenryJ** » Wed May 16, 2007 2:06 pm

The rust chews up the carbide cutter. Most shops hate to turn rusty stuff.
Cheaper to replace the rotor , than to ruin a set of cutters.
Rotors are not turned nearly as much anymore. The new pads last a long time and there is usually not enough material left to turn them and still maintain the minimum thickness. Some are actually not much more than .025 over the minimum to begin with.
If in doubt replace them. Don't buy the cheap ones. The iron content can be poor and uneven. Spend a little more and buy good stuff. Then break them in properly for a long smooth life.

killian96ss · Post by **killian96ss** » Wed May 16, 2007 2:14 pm

HenryJ wrote:Don't buy the cheap ones. The iron content can be poor and uneven. Spend a little more and buy good stuff.

The cheap ones are likely made in CHINA.

I have seen new rotors as cheap as $11 each.

The good ones definitely cost more, but there is still a chance they are made in CHINA.

Steve

Post by **HenryJ** » Wed May 16, 2007 2:59 pm

killian96ss wrote:... there is still a chance they are made in CHINA.

Probably with US steel though

Made in China doesn't bother me that much anymore. Brainwashed?

Perhaps.

I like my "made in China" boots

I will admit that I have been really considering the slotted rotors for my next set of rotors. Maybe there is a chance that they will be of pretty good quality.

StopTech wrote:PROPER BREAK-IN OF ROTORS AND PADS IS CRITICAL. Not properly doing so can cause permanent damage to rotors and adversely effect overall brake performance. Pads and rotors interact with each other to provide efficient brake performance. The break-in or bed-in procedure is done to condition the pad/rotor interface. Depending on the pad used, more or less pad material is uniformly transferred onto the disc as a thin film. The resins and bonding agents in some pads need to be heat cycled to work properly as well. By not properly bedding in pads, uneven pad material deposits can occur that may cause a vibration. Improper wear characteristics may also show up on either the pads, or rotors, or both. Always follow the recommended break-in procedure for any pads, rotors or brake systems.

Bedding pads:

The following is a guide that covers most manufacturers' recommendations (it is best to contact the manufacturer for exact instructions). 1. Slowly build heat in the pad by making slow stops, being sure to allow a minute or two for the pad to cool down while the car continues to move. 2. Repeat above step two or three times. 3. At full speed make hard racing type stops again, allowing cool down time between stops. 4. Repeat above steps two or three times or until brake fade is noticed. 5. Allow brake system to completely cool. Your pads should now be race ready. (It is important to remember that the pad and rotor surface must be mated to each other before ultimate performance will occur.)

RedDevil pads wrote:General procedure is the harder the break in, the better it is for the rotor and brake pad combination. We are trying to bring the rotor temperature up as high as possible on the initial break in as this will seal the rotor off with a brake pad transfer layer and you will basically be running brake pad against brake pad material. At this point the coating loses the satin finish that it had initially but the rotor has actually picked up a thousandths or two and has not lost any coating at all. Remember it is best to literally abuse the rotors early on. This procedure is the total opposite of what you would do with a cast iron rotor because of its inability to withstand shock due to the brittleness of cast iron.

Dragging the brakes on slow laps during break-in is something that must be avoided, due to the possibility of glazing over the pads. Also jacking the car up and running the car in gear and dragging the brakes must be avoided totally. If this procedure was not followed and you have experienced a glazing of the brake pads simply pull the pads up out of the caliper and deglaze then in a bead blaster. If a blaster isn’t available then you will need to take a coarse rasp file on its edge and rough the pad up knocking the hard shiny glaze off the pad. It is also very important to have a properly bled system to ensure that the calipers are clamping with full force as a spongy hydraulic pedal will cause glazing. For proper maintenance of the system it is best after very long events (100 laps or more) to deglaze the pads. In the event of short races 25 to 50 laps it is best after 2 or 3 events to deglaze and to also keep the system purged with fresh high temp fluid. Each time your brake calipers are heated and cooled the fluid will lose some of its temperature resistance along with being much more vulnerable to absorbing water into the system.

Dave Zeckhausen wrote:How to Bed-in Your Brakes

Bedding allows your brakes to reach their full potential. Until they are bedded, your brakes simply do not work as well as they can. If you've installed a big brake kit, changed your pads and rotors, or even if you've purchased a brand new car, you should set aside some time to bed the brakes in by following the instructions below. Proper bedding will improve pedal feel, reduce or eliminate brake squeal, and extend the life of your pads and rotors. For more on the theory of bedding, please refer to this excellent article by StopTech: Removing the Mystery from Brake Pad Bed-In.

Caution: After installing new pads/rotors or a big brake kit, the first few applications of the brake pedal will result in almost no braking power. Gently apply the brakes a few times at low speed in order to build up some grip before blasting down the road at high speed. Otherwise, you may be in for a nasty surprise the first time you hit the brakes at 60 mph.

When following these instructions, avoid doing it around other vehicles. Bedding is often best done early in the morning, when traffic is light, since other drivers will have no idea what you are up to and will respond in a variety of ways ranging from fear to curiosity to aggression. An officer of the law will probably not understand when you try to explain why you were driving erratically! Zeckhausen Racing does not endorse speeding on public roads and takes no responsibility for any injuries or tickets you may receive while following these instructions.

1.

From a speed of about 60mph, gently apply the brakes a couple of times to bring them up to operating temperature. This prevents you from thermally shocking the rotors and pads in the next steps.
2.

Make a series of eight near-stops from 60 to about 10 mph. Do it HARD by pressing on the brakes firmly, just shy of locking the wheels or engaging ABS. At the end of each slowdown, immediately accelerate back to 60mph. DO NOT COME TO A COMPLETE STOP! If you stop completely and sit for any length of time with your foot on the brake pedal, you will imprint pad material onto the hot rotors, which can lead to vibration, uneven braking, and could even ruin the rotors. With some less aggressive street pads, you may need fewer than eight near-stops. If your pedal gets soft or you feel the brakes going away, then you've done enough. Proceed to the next step.
3.

The brakes may begin to fade slightly after the 7th or 8th near-stop. This fade will stabilize, but not completely go away until the brakes have fully cooled. A strong smell from the brakes, and even smoke, is normal.
4.

After the 8th near-stop, accelerate back up to speed and cruise for a while, using the brakes as little as possible. The brakes need 5 to 10 minutes to cool down. Try not to become trapped in traffic or come to a complete stop while the brakes are still hot.
5.

If club race pads, such as Hawk Blue, are being used, add four near-stops from 80 to 10mph. If full race pads, such as Performance Friction 01 or Hawk HT 14, are being used, add four near-stops from 100 to 10 mph.
6.

After the break-in cycle, there should be a slight blue tint and a light gray film on the rotor face. The blue tint tells you the rotor has reached break-in temperature and the gray film is pad material starting to transfer onto the rotor face. This is what you are looking for. The best braking occurs when there is an even layer of of pad material deposited across the face of the rotors. This minimizes squealing, increases braking torque, and maximizes pad and rotor life.
7.

After the first break in cycle shown above, the brakes may still not be fully broken in. A second bed-in cycle, AFTER the brakes have cooled down fully from the first cycle, may be necessary before the brakes really start to perform well. This is especially true if you have installed new pads on old rotors. If you've just installed a big brake kit, the pedal travel may not feel as firm as you expected. After the second cycle, the pedal will become noticeably firmer. If necessary, bleed the brakes to improve pedal firmness.

cdnuser · Post by **cdnuser** » Thu May 17, 2007 3:56 am

I just got my front rotors replaced too. The mechanic cursed the last guy (dealer) who did the break job because he didn't properly grease the pins. No wonder they didn't last long. The break job was just done last Oct.

Well my sqeak is now gone for good. I thought that it was a bearing. Bearings are in great shape just bad crappy pads and cheap rotors to blame.

I hate dishonest dealers. Top quality my %&*#

I paid my mechanic $275 for new rotors and pads. Also includes labour

Dealer charged me $535 in Oct 06. And all they did was place new pads and lathed the rotors.

ace · Post by **ace** » Thu May 17, 2007 9:19 am

Anyone know of a quality standard rotor by this I mean non-slotted? I did see some Brembo rotors for the rear at $60.00/each....

ace · Post by **ace** » Fri May 18, 2007 2:59 am

I went and checked all of my rotors and they all look like the photo at the beginning of the thread. I thought it was just the rears but they all look this way. I have to admit though I didn't do anything about greasing the slide pins. My bust. Live, learn, and then pay I guess.

Post by **HenryJ** » Fri May 18, 2007 3:03 am

Some areas have more problems than others. I am guessing the salts added to the roads up there during the winters and just the winter conditions are contributing factors.
The drier climates seem to have less problems.

ace · Post by **ace** » Sun May 20, 2007 3:16 pm

Ok, this is strange. I checked my slide pins and they are perfectly fine. They are greased and everything. I wonder if something is defective from the factory causing this. Maybe the pads wore down to a point and didn't evenly wear correctly.

Post by **HenryJ** » Sun Oct 07, 2007 3:40 pm

HenryJ wrote:PSR-8638PSL Power Slot Performance Brake Rotors Brake Rotor, Left Front $115.95
PSR-8638PSR Right Front $115.95
PSR-8639PSL Left Rear $101.95
PSR-8639PSR Right Rear $101.95

Looks like these may be in my future. I will be needing brakes in the next year. I would like to try these.

Any suggestions for pads? The stock pads have done a very good job. I use NAPA Ceramix pads for the fleet. (part numbers?)

killian96ss · Post by **killian96ss** » Sun Oct 07, 2007 5:47 pm

The Power Slots are great rotors!

I like Performance Friction pads for there stopping power, but they will not last as long as ceramic pads, maybe 2/3 the life.

EBC and Hawk both make great pads in several flavors including ceramic.

Steve

Post by **HenryJ** » Sun Oct 07, 2007 6:07 pm

HWK-HB304Z-598 Hawk Performance Ceramic Brake Pads, Front $67.95
HWK-HB305Z-610 Hawk Performance Ceramic Brake Pads, Rear $58.95

ludwis · Post by **ludwis** » Wed Nov 07, 2007 3:51 pm

I typically get all my service needs done at the dealer. They seem to do a good job and if I ever have an issue with the truck I would have some history with them.

Well, I just picked up a set of power slot rotors and hawk pads for the fron and rear. I called the dealer tonight for a ball park figure for a brake job if I supplied the pads & rotors. They quoted me $91 an axle.

Does this sound reasonable to you guys?

Torskdoc · Post by **Torskdoc** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 7:01 am

Pulled my pins saturday and found all were ok. While I was at it I checked the pads and found all were way less than 50% thickness. So I went and got new pads (ceramics from Parts America). The rear rotors were fine, smooth, no ridges, glazing, hard spots, etc. The fronts were a different story. They looked like Topsgt's rears. So the fronts got replaced (Parts America, been using their house brand for 25+ years for rotors, drums,shoes,pads) and the rears got cut just enough to freshen them.

Mileage was 46000. Rotors were original GM's (the fastnut's were still on the studs.) and I imagine the pads were too. The inner pads were degraded on the outer edges with a smooth section in the middle. The rotors had a smooth center section with rusty outer and inner. Sections of rust (semi-circular) came off in my hand while handling.

I'm thinking that the pads are more of a culprit than the rotors. The pad outer edges felt spongier than the center (which was hard and shiny). Picked at the material with a small screwdriver and the outer edges flaked off in chunks while the center just got scratched. Maybe a manufacturing problem.

Wondering if this is just a GM part problem or if aftermartket parts have had similar problems. Never seen anything like this on any other cars I've worked on in 35+ years.

green02crew · Post by **green02crew** » Fri Aug 08, 2008 6:56 pm

Well it appears my caliper slide pins have stuck slightly. The inside of my rotors are all rusted and pitted pretty badly while the pads on the outside are heavily worn and chipping. 58k on the brakes is decent but not good. I guess I'll do a complete overhaul and see what comes of it. I knew they were not in good shape but I was informed by the shop doing my alignment that the calipers wouldn't be good if I let it go much longer. Is that true or BS?

F9K9 · Post by **F9K9** » Fri Aug 08, 2008 7:41 pm

Corroded pins could hurt the calibers but my rears have corroded up 2x and when I couldn't clean the pins up to suit me, I replaced them and all has been fine for 2 yrs.

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